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More Rapture talk...

We are going to reveal the timing of the rapture.
But let us use an expository method together and PROVE that what is being said is true. (what God is saying)
SO, we will go line by line, precept by precept.

Please follow along and let's keep any responses directly connected to the passages.
After we get through with questions and comments on this passage, we can discuss something else.
But if we get off in another area we will only add confusion.
I guarantee after we are done, the truth will be plain and clear.
If you will simply follow along carefully, I assure you it will become clear.....it's worth it!


2 Peter Chapter 3

1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:
("both" shows us 2 objectives are coming. And he wants us to sit up and pay attention to something that we should already know)
2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:
(ok, what he is going to tell us is A SURE THING because it came from prophets and the command of apostles)
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
("scoffer" here is a false teacher or mocker, root Greek is "empaizó")
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
(This is the verse that disproves the pre-trib rapture! #1>this is obviously a reference to the rapture! "His coming"
#2>why would the scoffers say, "Where is the promise of his coming?" if the Christians were raptured off the earth? If millions of people disappear, no one will be saying "Where is the promise of his coming?" THEY'LL KNOW HE CAME)

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
(skipping these next verses to stay on target)
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
(OK, we are STILL talking about the rapture here. "His promise" is waiting for more souls before He comes! "not willing that any should perish")
10But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
(did Peter just skip the rapture and all of a sudden start speaking about the day of the Lord? THIS is 100% proof that the rapture is within the day of the Lord! And we'll prove, not only as we have here, but we'll prove it again and again! Please continue to follow along)
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
(so we see Peter is obviously STILL speaking to a pre-raptured people! He's telling them to BE HOLY because judgement is coming!)
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
(This is another verse that proves there is no such thing as a pre-trib rapture! WHY would he tell believers here that we're looking for the "coming day of God" if we are going to be raptured 7 years earlier? God is not the author of confusion!)
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
(YET AGAIN, he disproves a pre-trib beyond shadow of doubt! Why would Peter say we are "looking for such things" and that we "will be found" if we have been raptured? In fact, why is he even writing this passage to the "beloved" (that's another word for born-again Christian)
Come on y'all, this is easy stuff! Black and white undeniable.


Ok, is the rapture and the "day of the Lord" the same? If so, we should be able to back it up with more Scripture.
ANd we can....and we will......and here it is: Happy
1 Thessalonians 5
5 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

Ok, after reading this passage we should see that the "times and seasons" is something we should already know.
And we know this because "the day of the Lord" is ALL THROUGHOUT the Bible!
And yet again, "the day of the Lord" is being considered right along with the rapture!
YOU CANNOT MISS THAT FACT. Happy
(but can we prove it?)
YES! And here's how...
Chapter 5 begins with "but", and the reason why is because this is a continuation of Paul speaking from chapter 4.
Well what is in chapter 4?
You know the verse well....it's very famous!

1 Thess 4 (last verses)
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Now if that's not the rapture then there isn't one!
So is THAT what Paul is still speaking of being the "day of the Lord"?
Let's read BOTH passages together and find out!


"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief."

PLEASE do not be in darkness my brethren! Do not let that day overtake you as a thief.
(BTW, since Paul is now speaking of "the day of the Lord" why is he telling us we are not in darkness that that day should overtake us as a thief?
Shouldn't we be raptured before the day of the Lord?)

Come on guys! Are you getting this?


Matthew 13:24-30
24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
26 But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
27 So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

I was going to go into detail on this passage, but it's so obvious I'll save everyone time and just point out the basics. First of all, this passage is most certainly speaking about "The kingdom of heaven". Jesus opens the parable with those words so it is obvious to us what He is speaking about.
The key to this parable the fact that the tares do not get taken before the wheat. If you haven't guessed already, believers are the wheat and the unfaithful are the tares. If God sent His angels to pull out all the unsaved and wicked and left the Christians, there would be insurmountable heartbreak and pain in many of the remaining believers. Some would probably even blame God and fall from grace, but that is another topic.

Unless this parable is an outright lie, or we have grossly misinterpreted it, then we can positively glean that the rapture is at the end. It's so very simple, and we have ALL these other Scriptures that are in complete harmony, it would be hard to miss the point.

Now that we have positively identified "the day of the Lord" in these next posts we will reveal WHEN that day is and what it will be like.
There are many many verses on the topic (because this is the next big thing God will do with humanity. In fact it is probably the BIGGEST thing He has EVER done with humanity) That is why it appears in the Old Testament and the New.
Last update on December 24, 7:17 am by Thomas.
Billy said...

What God has said is already written in Scripture. So what you are adding is what YOU think or believe God is saying. NOT what God is saying. That needs to be said. Now I will leave you alone.

Actually, if you are paying attention (something I'm beginning to see you do very little of) then you would understand that it is the Scripture which is included within the body of my post that is "what God is saying".
I never put words in God's mouth as you seem to constantly do with the members of this forum.

I do not think it takes a genius to figure out my reference to "what God is saying" is pertaining to the Bible verses I have included all throughout this text.
Hopefully it doesn't take a genius to figure you out either, that you are a contentious quarrel-starter who tries to accuse EVERYONE ELSE of ill intentions when YOU seem to be the only one who has them.

It's pretty sad all the negativity you bring to this place. There is a big difference between disagreeing with someone and the nasty attitude you push on people here. You think your subtle snide commentary goes unnoticed?
Or that you make posts like these to inject your accusations?

There's another one out there who is known as the "accuser of our brethren"
And he pretends to be our friend but he really wants to kill us.

Kinda reminds me of how you send me these nice chat messages trying to be all friendly:

But then you continually pull this garbage in public.
A double minded man is unstable in all his ways...
I encourage you to read this verse and learn it well:

2 Timothy 2:24-25
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

Be a part of the solution instead of constantly pointing out what YOU THINK are mistakes.
Try adding to the content instead of taking away from it with your constant onslaught of fellow believers.

So please stop with these lame attempts to catch me up in a mistake and your derogatory commentary.
And no need to send me chat messages any longer until your public and private speech to me gets in line with one other.
I'm not running a popularity contest and I am not here to waste time dealing with contentious individuals who have nothing better to do than derail the study of God's Word.
Last update on December 24, 9:48 am by Thomas.
Just the fact that all the christians in Africa and india and many other countries are being murdered right now for their faith proves that there is no pre trib rapture and the persecution will soon come to america for american christians to think they will be raptured before persecution is a bit naive and selfish and it really wouldn't be fair for those who are being persecuted right now for being a christian what makes an american christian so different then an african christian so different that they are martyred while an american christian will escape martyrdom with a rapture?
there is no pre trib rapture Christians will have to endure tribulation says this in matthew 24
The majority of American Christians believe in a pre-tribulation rapture of the church. Before things go bad they believe God will take them to Heaven. This feel good doctrine has no Biblical support and could be one of the biggest assumptions in Christianity. In fact Matthew 24 is clear that the rapture is after the Great Tribulation. The sad thing is that we could be prepared to face the Tribulation if we understood the Bible. Instead most American Christians will enter the seven year Great Tribulation having never even thought about what they would do.
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